Skip to main content

harry potter - Is Forbidden Forest east or west of Hogwarts?


In Prisoner of Azkaban (Ch 16), Rowling describes Forbidden Forest as seemingly being to the west of the castle:



Walking very close together so that nobody would see them, they crossed the hall on tiptoe beneath the cloak, then walked down the stone front steps into the grounds.


The sun was already sinking behind the Forbidden Forest, gilding the top branches of the trees.




So.. [setting sun]<-[forbidden forest]<-[characters going from castle].


The sun sets in the West; so forbidden forest is westward of the Castle.



However, JKR apparently produced a drawing showing that Forbidden Forest was to the east of the castle (according to DVD supplementary materials, the drawing was done by JKR at a hotel dining table for Stewart Craig, production designer for Philosopher's Stone film, when he started his work on the movie).


Is there any indication of which one is canonically correct and how we are supposed to reconcile the difference?


enter image description here



Answer



This is a repeat of an answer I wrote in the comments. I'm just placing it here as an official answer.


The Forbidden Forest should canonically be considered west of Hogwarts because, as DVK quotes in the question, the sun sets behind the Forbidden Forest. As per common knowledge, the sun rises in the east and sets in the west. The books are the most reliable sources of canon we have. As The Giant of Lannister puts it in the comments, the map was hand-drawn by J.K. Rowling in "just a few minutes" probably without direct reference to her books. It is very much possible that Rowling may have made a continuity error in drawing this map. The biggest indicator of this is evidenced in her positioning of the lake 'behind' the castle i.e. on the opposite side of the double front door entrance.


In Chapter 15, Beauxbatons and Durmstrang, of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire the Hogwarts students await the arrival of the delegations from Beauxbatons and Durmstrang on the front lawn:




When the bell rang early, Harry, Ron and Hermione hurried up to Gryffindor Tower, deposited their bags and books as they had been instructed, pulled on their cloaks and rushed back downstairs into the Entrance Hall. The Heads of houses were ordering their students into lines


... "Follow me, please," said Professor McGonagall, "first-years in front ... no pushing ..."


They filed down the front steps and lined up in front of the castle (pg 212, Bloomsbury Edt.)



So, from this position, virtually on the cusp of the bottom-most front step, it would not be possible for the students to see the Durmstrang ship arrive in the middle of the lake - if the lake were on the other side of the castle.



"The lake!" yelled Lee Jordan, pointing down at it. "Look at the lake!"


From their position at the top of the lawns overlooking the grounds, they had a clear view of the smooth black surface of the water ... Some disturbance was taking place deep in the centre ... and then, out in the very middle of the lake, a whirlpool appeared ... Slowly, magnificently, a ship rose out of the water, gleaming in the moonlight.




This quote explicitly places the lake within a field of vision from the front steps.



Now, although I have argued that the map is incorrect, I did notice something new whilst re-reading the first quote that I think must be mentioned:



(Pg 212 again) They filed down the front steps and lined up in front of the castle. It was a cold, clear evening; dusk was falling and a pale, transparent-looking moon was already shining over the Forbidden Forest ... "Nearly six," said Ron, checking his watch and then staring at the drive which led to the front gates.



This last quote presents a new problem, I think. If it is dusk, around 6pm, then the moon should be rising over the east, right? According to this scene, east happens to be over the Forbidden Forest - which ties in with the map Rowling has drawn - but this contradicts the sunset in Prisoner of Azkaban (see DVK's quote in the question), which also happens over the Forest, suggesting the Forest's position as to the west of Hogwarts.


I think Rowling may have made some continuity mistakes with the Hogwarts grounds that we can't really make sense out of. It's no big deal, really, it's similar to the mix-up with every September 1st (start of the school year) happening to land on a Monday, the start of the school week; but for the purposes of this discussion, it makes answering the question difficult.


Comments

Post a Comment

Popular posts from this blog

harry potter - Do the Kwikspell courses work?

In Harry Potter we are introduced to Kwikspell course in The Chamber of Secrets (and never hear about it again). We see Filch taking courses, presumably by mail. The descriptions of Kwikspell make me think it is for people who are weak in magic (kind of like how Neville was supposed to be when he was younger), but had magic in them nonetheless. However, Ron's comments later in the chapter make it sound like it is mainly for Squibs to learn magic. However, it is strongly implied through out all the books that Squibs are essentially Muggles, and will never be able to do magic. How then is a Kwikspell course supposed to work? Do we have any information to know if it works at all? Is it a scam? An answer from any level of canon is welcome. Answer Kwikspell courses are (probably) useful to some wizards, but not to squibs. The Kwikspell course literature comes with two testimonials. Madam Z. Nettles of Topsham writes: ‘I had no memory for incantations and my potions were a family joke...
Post a Comment
Read more

futurama - How much time is lost in 'Time Keeps on Slippin''

In time Keeps on Slippin' , Farnsworth creates a basketball team which he matures by abusing Chronitons. This leads to time skipping forward by random, but ever increasing amounts. How much time was skipped in this way? Answer Unfortunately, I don't think a good estimate can be made for this, for two reasons: Many of the time skips move forward by an indeterminate amount of time. At one point, the Professor mentions localized regions of space skipping forward much more than others. We then see two young boys on the street below complaining about having to pay social security, only to suddenly become senior citizens and start complaining about wanting their money. Thus, each individual could have experienced a different amount of time skippage.
Post a Comment
Read more

star wars - What "exactly" happens when someone turns to the Dark Side?

When I saw the original Star Wars saga as a kid, the concept of the Dark Side imprinted in me was quite simple. You did a bad thing, so you're a bad person so you go to the Dark Side and keep doing bad things. Now, obviously this doesn't hold true in reality. In my mind it is perfectly reasonable for Luke to kill the Emperor and Vader and then just flee the Death Star and rejoin the Alliance. After all they are at war, those are enemy officers that have captured him and are taunting him by threatening with death of all loved ones and the whole operation was intended to kill the Emperor anyway. The same would hold true for Anakin. He could have killed Mace Windu to save the Chancellor and Padme but that doesn't mean he's going to then go mad and kill all Jedis including children. It doesn't add up from a merely psychological point of view. He had a set of objectives and that made him want to keep the Chancellor alive (quite valid by the way, Mace Windu is quite clums...
Post a Comment
Read more

star trek - Warning regarding forward saucer section in Nemesis?

In Star Trek: Nemesis , just before the Enterprise rams into the Scimitar, Picard sends a text message from his captain's chair arm pad to Troi — who is manning the helm in lieu of the crewman who was just blown out through what was once the view screen — indicating that she should put full impulse on standby. (Literally, if you watch the scene closely, Troi's console prefaces the order with "TXT MSG" !) My question is: Did Picard also somehow warn crew members in the forward saucer section about what was about to happen? The ramming of the Scimitar was a heat of the moment decision. Considering that he also resorted to calling the auto-destruct sequence shortly after (which ended up being offline), he probably was of the mindset that any losses would be acceptable in order to hault Shinzon's march to Earth. Still, I'm curious. Answer The original script indicates that he called for the crew to " brace for impact ". Whether that call (or the comma...
Post a Comment
Read more